[debate-l] RE: What is IDEA's Mission in Asia?

Mon Oct 2 15:18:30 CDT 2006

I would not add anything to the Seul/Bejing tournaments because Jason did 
really excellent  job in explaining why having  tournaments at the same weekend 
is not a very good idea, however I do want to ask something else, which is connected
with the whole story. 

Last year when the first IDEA China university tournament was announced and 
I did have some objections about the time and the place of the tournament, I was told 
that me, as a representative of IDEA organisational member, do not have a say, 
because that tournament was organised by IDEA - USA which is not a 
membership organisation. It was explained to me (at these listserves, you 
might remember) that I have a say  only  about  IDEA Netherlands activities, but not 
IDEA USA ones. 

I am a kind of confused now about, Noel, your invitation to Jason to join IDEA and 
come to Prague and get involved in planning IDEA activities. Can you please, explain, 
what has changed? Has IDEA USA become membership organisation, is IDEA Netherlands
organising this year China tournament, something else? What has changed from last
year that now the IDEA Netherlands members can influence IDEA USA activities? 

Bojana 

---- Noel Selegzi <nselegzi at sorosny.org> piše: 
> Hi Jason,
> 
> I appreciate your strong feelings in this matter, but still do not think
> there's any real problem in there being a tournament in Seoul and
> another in Beijing (or the Oxford IV for that matter).  You may not
> think a two hour flight is very far, but for many it is.  Nonetheless,
> point well taken: we will, in the future, try to do a better job in
> coordinating our activities with you.  We hope that you will help us by
> doing the same.
> 
> All the best,
> 
> Noel
> 
> P.S. Your announcement of your tournament never got through to our
> listservs.  You may want to re-send it.
> 
> Noel S. Selegzi
> International Debate Education Association
> Open Society Institute 
> 400 West 59th Street
> New York, NY 10019
> Ph: (212) 547-6938
> Fx: (212) 548-4610
> www.idebate.org
> To Join IDEA: www.idebate.org/join
> To Support IDEA: www.idebate.org/support
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> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jason Jarvis [mailto:debatekorea at yahoo.com] 
> Sent: Sunday, October 01, 2006 11:38 AM
> To: Noel Selegzi; jeanne4 at wharton.upenn.edu;
> debate-l at mailhost.soros.org; university-l at mailhost.soros.org
> Subject: What is IDEA's Mission in Asia?
> 
> 
>  The crux of your position is that because people in
> Asia havent joined IDEA, you have no way of knowing
> about regional events.  
> 
> This is not true for a few reasons:
> 
> 1) IDEA members (Claremont) have attended the
> Northeast Asian tournament every year it has been
> held.
> 2) It has been advertised on your listservs every year
> (including this one).
> 3) A Korean team won the IDEA Youth Forum this year.  
>  Was it honestly impossible to consult with them?
> 4) IDEA members have been in Northeast Asia, as
> recently as July and August and were well aware of the
> competition.  Your failure to communicate within your
> own organization is hardly our fault.
> 5) Debaters in Asia are not attempting to develop
> debate in Europe or America. Why should they consult
> you?
> 
> You also say that you are under no obligation to
> communicate or consult with people in the region that
> you are planning to work in....even when IDEA is
> entering a region for the first time.
> 
> This is NONSENSE.
> 
> The real question, Noel, is this:
> What are the GOALS of IDEA? WHY are you holding debate
> tournaments in China?  
> 
> If your goal is to promote debate in a region, then
> you have an OBLIGATION to SEEK OUT, CONTACT, and
> COORDINATE with the people who are already doing some
> of those things in the region where you plan to work. 
> 
> 
> WHY do you have such an obligation?
> 
> (A) Asian debating pre-dates IDEA.  IDEA is neither
> necessary nor sufficient for the promotion of Asian
> debate.  Democracies here may be developing (Thailand
> notwithstanding), but debate has its own traditions. 
> The All Asians is entering its 14th year. This isnt
> Eastern Europe or the former Soviet Union.  
> 
> (B) If all you plan to do is import people with no
> local knowledge, and to ignore the needs of the
> region; be prepared to run an irrelevant organization
> that meets with hostility.  At a mimimum, you have
> successfully alienated the Korean college community,
> and potentially Japan as well...Since Korea is hosting
> the 14th All Asians, which will be making its first
> appearance in Northeast Asia ever, I would say this is
> an inauspicious start to your plans for Asia.
> 
> (C) Efficient use of resources would mean
> coordination, rather than duplication. (Obviously)  
> 
> (D) Given your professed lack of knowledge, its
> possible your own efforts could augmented by the local
> knowledge of people living here. (Is this fact really
> surprising?)  
> 
> (E) By not coordinating your efforts you run the risk
> of DAMAGING regional debate.  For Northeast Asia this
> is true in the following ways:
> 
> -Asian debaters/coaches that want to travel in
> November will have to choose, or will be unable to
> attend both competitions because they are obligated to
> one tournament.  The fact is that you didnt put
> together a small domestic competition for only Chinese
> people.  IDEA is ACTIVELY LOBBYING non-Chinese to
> attend.  This damages the other regional tournament
> that is taking place in Seoul (which, FYI, is only a 2
> hour flight from Beijing).  
> 
> Personally, despite being the Chief Adjudicator for
> the next All Asians, I cant go to Beijing because I
> have obligations to the Northeast Asian Open.  The
> Beijing competition would be a great opportunity to
> expose more Chinese debaters to the Asian
> championships, and other regional events.  I am hardly
> the only person who will not have the option of
> attending both. 
> 
> -It isolates China from Asia.  While its well and good
> for Americans to swoop in to save the Chinese with
> their debate knowledge, your Adjudication team has
> never attended the All Asians or the AUDC (do you even
> know what that acronym stands for?).  I didnt see a
> whole lot of experience in the WUDC format on their
> CV's either.  What will the Chinese do when you leave?
>  How will this help them participate in ASIAN
> DEBATING? 
> 
> Undoubtedly it is good that people have some debating
> rather than none, and there will be people in China
> who get a tournament that they might not have had.
> 
> However, those goals could have been achieved and both
> tournaments could be better if IDEA were to coordinate
> with people living in Asia.  No explanation was given
> for why November is the only month of the year you
> could hold the competition in.  Overlapping with
> events in Europe and the US is not a justification for
> the dates you chose.  The Asian calendar would be easy
> to obtain and should take primacy.  
> 
> Ultimately, the explanations for the lack of
> coordination are poor and disingenuous.  IDEA could
> have, and SHOULD HAVE KNOWN.  
> 
> Furthermore, despite using polite rhetoric, your
> response makes it clear that IDEA needs to spend a
> good deal of time developing a clear Mission with
> regards to Asia, as well as streamlining its own
> internal communications before it seeks to meddle in
> the affairs of a region which might very well be
> better off without its help.
> 
> 
>     
> Jason L. Jarvis
> Assistant Dean and Lecturer
> 
> Korea Development Institute Graduate School of Public Policy and
> Management
> http://www.kdischool.ac.kr/
> Office: 82-2-3299-1031
> Email: debatekorea at kdischool.ac.kr
> 
> 
> Korea Debate Listserv
>  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/koreadebatelist/
>   
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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