[university-l] RE: What is IDEA's Mission in Asia?

Tue Oct 3 01:27:48 CDT 2006

Hi Jason,

Thanks for the list of names, most of which we do already have, but the new additions are welcome.

Again, we will do our best to improve communications and cordinatorion.  I wish you all your success with your event.

All the best,

Noel

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Noel Selegzi
400 West 59th Street
4th Floor
New York, NY 10019

www.idebate.org

-----Original Message-----
From: Jason Jarvis <debatekorea at yahoo.com>
To: Noel Selegzi <nselegzi at sorosny.org>; jeanne4 at wharton.upenn.edu <jeanne4 at wharton.upenn.edu>; debate-l at mailhost.soros.org <debate-l at mailhost.soros.org>; university-l at mailhost.soros.org <university-l at mailhost.soros.org>
Sent: Tue Oct 03 01:51:23 2006
Subject: Re: [university-l] RE: What is IDEA's Mission in Asia?

My point is not that you need to coordinate with me,
it is that you ought to be coordinating generally with
people in the region where you work (thus the
questions about your Mission in Asia).  

A quick (and incomplete) list of important debate
movers and shakers in Asia:

James Haft and Madame Piayanart, Chulalongkorn
University (Thailand)

TJ (Thepparith Senamngern), Assumption University,
Thailand

Hafiedz Iqbal, UT Mara, Malaysia

Logan Balavijendran and Omar Salahuddin, MMU, Malaysia

Jess Lopez (and all the Ateneo crew), ADMU,
Philippines

Carl Ng (i forget his institution), Philippines

Irma Nurzahrah, International Islamic University,
Malaysia

Vikram, et al Nanyang Technological University,
Singapore

Chihiro Nakagawa, U of Tokyo, Japan

Loke Wing Fatt, SAID, Singapore

Many of these folks have already been to China.  If
you dont know any of them, then I wonder who you have
been working with during your decade long involvement
in Asia....

Failure to coordinate, consult, etc hurts your event
as well as the Northeast Asians, and limits the
overall effectiveness of both events to provide
debate.  Simple pragmatism makes it a good IDEA.  

Its also essential to being down with The Mission.

--- Noel Selegzi <nselegzi at sorosny.org> wrote:

> Hi Jason,
> 
> I appreciate your strong feelings in this matter,
> but still do not think
> there's any real problem in there being a tournament
> in Seoul and
> another in Beijing (or the Oxford IV for that
> matter).  You may not
> think a two hour flight is very far, but for many it
> is.  Nonetheless,
> point well taken: we will, in the future, try to do
> a better job in
> coordinating our activities with you.  We hope that
> you will help us by
> doing the same.
> 
> All the best,
> 
> Noel
> 
> P.S. Your announcement of your tournament never got
> through to our
> listservs.  You may want to re-send it.
> 
> Noel S. Selegzi
> International Debate Education Association
> Open Society Institute 
> 400 West 59th Street
> New York, NY 10019
> Ph: (212) 547-6938
> Fx: (212) 548-4610
> www.idebate.org
> To Join IDEA: www.idebate.org/join
> To Support IDEA: www.idebate.org/support
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> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jason Jarvis [mailto:debatekorea at yahoo.com] 
> Sent: Sunday, October 01, 2006 11:38 AM
> To: Noel Selegzi; jeanne4 at wharton.upenn.edu;
> debate-l at mailhost.soros.org;
> university-l at mailhost.soros.org
> Subject: What is IDEA's Mission in Asia?
> 
> 
>  The crux of your position is that because people in
> Asia havent joined IDEA, you have no way of knowing
> about regional events.  
> 
> This is not true for a few reasons:
> 
> 1) IDEA members (Claremont) have attended the
> Northeast Asian tournament every year it has been
> held.
> 2) It has been advertised on your listservs every
> year
> (including this one).
> 3) A Korean team won the IDEA Youth Forum this year.
>  
>  Was it honestly impossible to consult with them?
> 4) IDEA members have been in Northeast Asia, as
> recently as July and August and were well aware of
> the
> competition.  Your failure to communicate within
> your
> own organization is hardly our fault.
> 5) Debaters in Asia are not attempting to develop
> debate in Europe or America. Why should they consult
> you?
> 
> You also say that you are under no obligation to
> communicate or consult with people in the region
> that
> you are planning to work in....even when IDEA is
> entering a region for the first time.
> 
> This is NONSENSE.
> 
> The real question, Noel, is this:
> What are the GOALS of IDEA? WHY are you holding
> debate
> tournaments in China?  
> 
> If your goal is to promote debate in a region, then
> you have an OBLIGATION to SEEK OUT, CONTACT, and
> COORDINATE with the people who are already doing
> some
> of those things in the region where you plan to
> work. 
> 
> 
> WHY do you have such an obligation?
> 
> (A) Asian debating pre-dates IDEA.  IDEA is neither
> necessary nor sufficient for the promotion of Asian
> debate.  Democracies here may be developing
> (Thailand
> notwithstanding), but debate has its own traditions.
> 
> The All Asians is entering its 14th year. This isnt
> Eastern Europe or the former Soviet Union.  
> 
> (B) If all you plan to do is import people with no
> local knowledge, and to ignore the needs of the
> region; be prepared to run an irrelevant
> organization
> that meets with hostility.  At a mimimum, you have
> successfully alienated the Korean college community,
> and potentially Japan as well...Since Korea is
> hosting
> the 14th All Asians, which will be making its first
> appearance in Northeast Asia ever, I would say this
> is
> an inauspicious start to your plans for Asia.
> 
> (C) Efficient use of resources would mean
> coordination, rather than duplication. (Obviously)  
> 
> (D) Given your professed lack of knowledge, its
> possible your own efforts could augmented by the
> local
> knowledge of people living here. (Is this fact
> really
> surprising?)  
> 
> (E) By not coordinating your efforts you run the
> risk
> of DAMAGING regional debate.  For Northeast Asia
> this
> is true in the following ways:
> 
> -Asian debaters/coaches that want to travel in
> November will have to choose, or will be unable to
> attend both competitions because they are obligated
> to
> one tournament.  The fact is that you didnt put
> together a small domestic competition for only
> Chinese
> people.  IDEA is ACTIVELY LOBBYING non-Chinese to
> attend.  This damages the other regional tournament
> that is taking place in Seoul (which, FYI, is only a
> 2
> hour flight from Beijing).  
> 
> Personally, despite being the Chief Adjudicator for
> the next All Asians, I cant go to Beijing because I
> have obligations to the Northeast Asian Open.  The
> Beijing competition would be a great opportunity to
> expose more Chinese debaters to the Asian
> championships, and other regional events.  I am
> hardly
> the only person who will not have the option of
> attending both. 
> 
> -It isolates China from Asia.  While its well and
> good
> for Americans to swoop in to save the Chinese with
> their debate knowledge, your Adjudication team has
> never attended the All Asians or the AUDC (do you
> even
> know what that acronym stands for?).  I didnt see a
> whole lot of experience in the WUDC format on their
> CV's either.  What will the Chinese do when you
> leave?
>  How will this help them participate in ASIAN
> DEBATING? 
> 
> Undoubtedly it is good that people have some
> debating
> rather than none, and there will be people in China
> who get a tournament that they might not have had.
> 
> However, those goals could have been achieved and
> both
> tournaments could be better if IDEA were to
> coordinate
> with people living in Asia.  No explanation was
> given
> for why November is the only month of the year you
> could hold the competition in.  Overlapping with
> events in Europe and the US is not a justification
> for
> the dates you chose.  The Asian calendar would be
> easy
> to obtain and should take primacy.  
> 
> Ultimately, the explanations for the lack of
> coordination are poor and disingenuous.  IDEA could
> have, and SHOULD HAVE KNOWN.  
> 
> Furthermore, despite using polite rhetoric, your
> response makes it clear that IDEA needs to spend a
> good deal of time developing a clear Mission with
> regards to Asia, as well as streamlining its own
> internal communications before it seeks to meddle in
> the affairs of a region which might very well be
> better off without its help.
> 
> 
>     
> Jason L. Jarvis
> Assistant Dean and Lecturer
> 
> Korea Development Institute Graduate School of
> Public Policy and
> Management
> http://www.kdischool.ac.kr/
> Office: 82-2-3299-1031
> Email: debatekorea at kdischool.ac.kr
> 
> 
> Korea Debate Listserv
>  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/koreadebatelist/
>   
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> 

Jason L. Jarvis
Assistant Dean and Lecturer

Korea Development Institute Graduate School of Public Policy and Management
http://www.kdischool.ac.kr/
Office: 82-2-3299-1031
Email: debatekorea at kdischool.ac.kr

Korea Debate Listserv
 http://groups.yahoo.com/group/koreadebatelist/

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